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This story contains spoilers for the season four episode of Succession, Living+. Every week The Age and The Sydney Morning Herald will be recapping the latest episode of Succession. You can listen to our recap podcast here.
Ask most people who the funniest pairing on Succession is, and there’s a high chance they’ll pick Tom and Greg. The self-described “disgusting brothers” are the obvious answer, both awkward outsiders whose desperation to infiltrate the inner sanctum is as ludicrous as the capacious handbags they make fun of.
But for those with a more discerning eye, it’s becoming clear that the show’s true odd couple are Frank Vernon (Peter Friedman) and Karl Muller (David Rasche). Theirs is not an in-your-face bromance in the style of Tom and Greg. Instead, they boast the charm of an old married couple whose bond is as tight as the compression socks they’re both fond of.
No longer content to make up the numbers, Frank and Karl have elbowed their way to the front in the final season of Succession.Credit: HBO / Binge
The pair have been around WayStar Royco for as long as anyone can remember (Kendall would no doubt call them “day ones”), career suits whose corporate savvy has kept them alive. Frank remains the company vice chairman despite being fired twice, while Karl is Waystar Royco’s chief financial officer.
For much of Succession, the pair have existed in the background, but the death of Logan Roy breathed new life into these stagnant graybeards. No longer content to make up the numbers, Frank and Karl (along with Gerri) have elbowed their way to the front in the final season, and quite frankly, it feels long overdue.
Ahead of the final few episodes, I spoke with Peter Friedman and David Rasche about staying alive, Succession without Logan and what it takes to be a serious person.
Four seasons in, and you’re both still standing. How do you feel?
David Rasche: Everyone is very surprised. After the very first season, [series creator] Jesse Armstrong said to me, “David, sorry you didn’t have more to do with Karl, but you never know; there could be a second season.” And here we are.
Peter Friedman: Well, I thought it would be the making of me when I got fired during the pilot; I thought, “This is the guy with the secrets; he must know where the bodies are buried.”
But I am mystified by Frank. Why is this guy, who we have not seen doing anything terrible, hanging with these people? He has been fired twice now. [Go] play golf! I suspect he likes the excitement of it all but also feels he can put the brakes on the nastiness if he’s around there.
Emperor Penguins, Keystone F–ks. Call them what you will, Frank Gerri and Karl are having a big impact this season.Credit: HBO / Binge
Graybeards, Emperor Penguins, Keystone F–ks: No matter the name, Frank, Karl and Gerri are taking it to the sibs this season. Does it feel like their time after so long on the sidelines?
DR: To borrow Logan’s words, Frank and I are very serious people. We’re well-connected, experienced business people, and the kids are overprivileged with an inflated sense of their own ability and self-worth. And so, the question for this season is how much will we let them hurt us? I would like it to be not at all.
PF: It’s funny, a lot of people are saying the Graybeards are having this big season, but I don’t feel that. It could have to do with Logan being out of action, so we’re consulted occasionally, and then we’re doing our own planning and worrying behind the scenes.
The death of Logan was one of the great Succession moments; both Frank and Karl were on the plane when he died. Do you think they miss him?
PF: He and Frank were tight in the early days. But as we’ve seen in the past four seasons, things got wonkier, and Frank sided with Kendall a few times and bounced around a bit. But he still has an abiding love for the guy clearly, and all they’ve been through together.
DR: My affection for Logan is purely for his business sense. He was a terrible father but a brilliant businessman. Karl is a shark, Logan is a shark, and they respect each other, but that’s it.
It has paved the way for Frank and Karl to become everyone’s new favourite duo, their scenes in Norway were incredible. How much do you improvise on set?
PF: Our stuff is so specific and limited. It’s almost like a drive-by; we come in, drop some bombs and then split. But we don’t tend to adlib. I wouldn’t want it to match wits with Jesse.
David, you delivered one of the speeches of the season with “Tom is a Clumsy Interloper”. Did you play around with that at all?
DR: That was a terrific scene. I didn’t change a word because these guys are just so good. Jesse doesn’t do this for his health, he has this sort of artistic striving for excellence that is relentless.
I mean, sure, he’s happy to make all that money, lord knows how much money he’s made, but that’s not what he’s about. The number of hours he puts into this show, the rewrites, the edits, it’s insane. So no, I don’t tend to stray off script.
Both Frank and Karl have interesting connections with Kendall. In episode three, Frank tells Kendall that Logan is “an old bastard, but he loved you”, whereas Karl butts head with him in episode six. How do you see their relationship with the number one boy?
PF: There is genuine affection, and Kendall returns to Frank when he needs that encouragement in a warm climate instead of a snarky one. Otherwise, he keeps his distance. I don’t think he ever goes to see Frank when he feels sure of himself.
That’s what’s so great about Jeremy and the role. You start in season one thinking Kendall is a schmuck, and then you see him get kicked to the curb all the time. He almost becomes pitiable.
DR: In Karl’s eyes, Kendall is an alcoholic junkie f–k up, and he was going to ruin everything I had in Living +, so he had to be corralled. He’s got my d–k, but I’ve got his. For the Graybeards, there is an element of schadenfreude when it comes to Kendall and all the siblings; it’s nice to see somebody with a big head get taken down.
OK, now a hard one. What is your all-time favourite Succession moment?
PF: Impossible question. What always perks my ears up is when they refer to me by some funky nickname, Ancient Grains, Sir Talky of F–kchester or Bore Vidal—those kinds of throwaway lines I love.
DR: For me, it would have to be Boar on the Floor. Tony Roche wrote it, and he absolutely should have won an Emmy. It is one of the most inventive and awful scenes; my children couldn’t watch it. My son found it upsetting to watch their father humiliated like that.
It’s impossible to talk about the ending of this series, but people are naturally wondering who will come out on top. What can you tell us about the end that won’t get you in trouble?
PF: They’re showing you that whoever wins will be sorry. You’ve been watching this for years, and it’s clear there is no upside to winning in Succession. What’s the upside? A yacht with miserable people? These people are always unhappy; no matter what they have, they’re always unhappy. So take from that what you will.
DR: No comment, but you won’t be disappointed.
Succession is dropping new episodes every Monday on Foxtel and Binge.
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